Blumenstein Ultra Fi

If we are looking for comparisons I am in the very fortunate position of having in my possession:

Orca Classic Centre-set x 2 - Birch
Orca Mini's x 2 - Birch
Dungeness sub x 2 - Birch

Along with:

Bee-Pre (Stock EH 300b)
Paramount (Sophia Carbon Princess 300b)
Stereomour (kit to be built in the next fortnight with stock tubes 2A3)

Sources would be a Schitt Bifrost DAC / 2014 Airport Express (used as DAC) / Mac Mini (used as DAC)

I also have the stands and Blumenstein cables on the way to throw into the mix...

If we thought there would be value I can test a few combo's of the above if there is anyone juggling configurations. I won't even pretend to begin to throw around the audiophile terminology you see in magazines / online but I am about to start setting them up across the house and I would happily do some comparisons in the two room sizes I am using (4m x 4m and 4m x 8m) and give some feedback on how well the various combo's fill the room and handle some differing types of music if anyone thinks it would help them evaluate options.

Bill
 
I have a pair of Orca deluxe center channels on top of dungeness subs in my bedroom system. They are mated with a perfect and serviced Nak Dragon, a Bee Pre with every possible tweak and a pair of Paramour 2s with upgraded caps and iron (Cobalt pinstripe opts). I've had the Orcas plus subs for many months now and they always were OK. I have to say that now they have started to shine. Always chamber music (bedroom system as I said) and low volumes. All the time they missed the "box" resonance of a cello that my WE do so well. I have to report that they now do it. After many tries now I have a bedroom system that is utterly engaging.

I also have a pair of Orca minis at the office. They're still missing the cello box resonance but I expect they will eventually get it!

BTW Clark, we need a mini dungeness to mate the Orca minis!

Oh, please don't ask me to compare as I won't do it.
 
Nice bedroom system. I think I would be happy with that as my main rig. I have always wanted to hear cobalt outputs...John 
 
Clark have you tried the new Seductor amp with the Orcas? Any words on that?

BTW I recently received a pair of Orca Mini's in BB that are starting to burn in nicely and I'm loving every step. They're currently powered by a $20 Lepai Class-T amp which I'm sure is not doing them any justice but the Bottlehead S.E.X. kit is in the mail and I'm looking forward to getting it hooked up!
 
tdogzthmn, the Mini's are remarkably close to the full Orca's. The primary difference to my ear is the fuller Bass that the full Orca's have, however, while this is a clearly audible difference, if I drop a Dungeness sub into the mix in a room that is roughly 4m x 4m there is very little between a set of Mini's + Dungeness and a set of full Orca's + Dungeness. Both are spectacularly good and perform similarly to my ear when supported by a sub.

Bill

 
2wo said:
Nice bedroom system. I think I would be happy with that as my main rig. I have always wanted to hear cobalt outputs...John
Click to expand...
Well John; If you are ever in Eugene OR, I can oblige; as my BH Customs Soul Sister linestage has MQ B7 cobalt opts, and my BH Customs 2A3 amp has MQ TFA 2004 M4/ten slices of cobalt opts. They feed Blumenstein Orcas and BUF Subs with Oppo dvp 95 and vinyl as sources. Lovely system!
Cheers, Hank
 
tjessen said:
Can one order an Orca centre set with the same cabinet as an orca mini? TIA.
Click to expand...

Oh- indeed!  That is a good idea.  If you order one, we will build it and put as an option in our online store. A single Center channel is 1/2 the price of a pair of Minis.

BTW,  we have redone the website somewhat.  Stripped down and simpler.  We also have a new package deal up right now which is Mini's, the new stands, and the new Dungeness Max sub. 
 
Give it a look! 

http://www.blumensteinaudio.com/

Best,

Clark
 
Thanks Clark, I'm just sizing up a home theater at the moment, not yet making purchasing, but I do love your business, beautiful and simple products!
 
Using some Belden 5000UE from the Stereomour, but uncertain what to use for the subwoofer to the speakers. Anyone have a suggestion. Probably Ill just order some more 5000UE
 
I had believed that I received a wire with my Dungeness subs.  If that was not the case, I grabbed a small gauge wire and ran them from the Orcas to the Dungeness speaker level inputs.

The wire will carry no current, maybe a pA of current.  So the gauge is not a consideration.  The inputs of the plate amp are high impedance and are for voltage sensing alone.  Much like the inputs of an Op-Amp.

I really would be surprised if there was a sonic difference between #26 AWG and #12 AWG wire.
 
Thanks Grainger, that was my feeling since in the Dungeness photo's it looks like Clark is just using zip cord. I also thought that wire came with the speaker.
 
I've been listening to alot of vinyl since getting a turntable again.  The Orcas do a great job conveying the tonal richness captured on the spinning black disks.  Digital is still preferable for its simplicity, fidelity, and clean playback.  However, the ritual of vinyl playback is still very compelling and pleasurable.

Aside from the Orcas I'm thinking some larger and more efficient speakers would work well in vinyl playback.  Hearing a record playing through a classic speaker design and tube amp seems more authentic to me.
 
Tom, our current favorite system is birch Orca Mini's, Floor Stands, and a pair of Dungeness Max subs.  The source and amp is a Denon DL103r on a 16" Pete Riggle woody tonearm going into Paramount 300B's.  Its a really well balanced system and sound. We are thinking of putting up a combo system special for this set of speakers to encourage more people to try it out. 

 
Reposting this information from another thread about the proper hookup of our Dungeness or Dungeness Max subwoofers:

For speaker wire hookup, the lengths of speaker wire used for the subwoofer amplifier's inputs is simply doubled up (biwired) at either the binding posts of the fullrange speaker or alternatively at the binding posts of your stereo amplifier.  Either place does not affect the sound quality.  As well, it can be an assymetric hookup location in this respect without affecting sound quality, which is convenient as well. 

The quality of this speaker wire is essentially inaudible as well, which is also convinient because the quality of the typically long length of RCA cable for the inputs would be audible.  I recommend cheap high gauge wire that comes on a roll.  This set of speaker wires only goes into the "from amplifier" section of inputs of the subwoofer amp, (and does not come back out of the "to speaker" outputs, which keeps those nasty electrolytic caps from being engaged).  Its a pure and simple method of hookup, and only bleeds a tiny amount of signal from a Power Amp, rather than drawing 50% of the output of a Pre Amp.

RCA hookups can have some sonic advantages in certain cases, however, and in the case of Bottlehead products, RCA subwoofer inputs work very well!  So in general, I feel that speaker level vs. RCA hookups for a subwoofer will all depend on the makeup of the rest of your system.  While speaker wire inputs are universally compatible for prettymuch any power amplifer, some Bottlehead Pre-amps have a provision for dual RCA outputs ((one set to the stereo power amp, one set to the subwoofer(s). And they sound great hooked up that way with my speakers/subs!  I like to match lengths (a less practical recommendation) and types/brands (a more practical recommendation) for the quad of RCA cables coming from the back of the pre amp.

Hope those explainations and tips help!

Best,

Clark
 
Thanks for the input Clark!  I just installed my new AT120E cart on my audio technica LP120 turntable. Really clean and detailed playback, on my newer LP discs I can't hear the noise floor even at -20DB. 

Do you think the benefits of the new driver in the Orca Mini, or is it more of the Dungeness Max that is making the most impact on the sound of that setup?
 
Tom, The way it is with alot of our designs is that what produces the resultant sound is less from the driver, and more about the cabinet. 

That said, the Orca Mini driver considered nude is better extended up top, and is rated to handle more power as well.  The way we use it, however, it actually benefits from the small, thin walled cabinet because of our "high tech" solid wood internal bracing, and it took us a long time, and many iterations to figure this out.  The impulse response and frequency response is phenomenal.  The Dungeness Max subs are also bigger, and go lower and are more powerful than the Dungeness Classic/Deluxe subs... but this is for a more nuanced reason than you might think.  We still feel that the Dungeness Classic sub is actually the right sub for the Orca Classics.  And so too, the Orca Mini's go best with the Dungeness Max, and don't really work very well with the smaller Dungeness Classic.

The "sound" of the Dungeness Max (if a subwoofer can be thought of as having a characteristic sound) is most importantly in keeping with the overall sound making aesthetic of the Mini- which is more geared towards extension, neutrality and flatness, and still remains a manageable size. 

On the other hand, I still think of the Orca Classics as our "classic" sound.  I don't want to go out on a limb and say that it was inspired from "classic" audio, but as a music historian and audio history nut, the Classic's design, which evolved for 8 years of uninterrupted production and refinement couldn't help but have been inspired by all the amazing old and new gear that I've heard over the years.  And you can see the influences of classic audio in the materials - All paper cones including the subwoofer versus the Orca Mini/Max's use of aluminum in the fullranger's dust cap and subwoofer's cone for assistance in reproducing transients from the same driver diameters - 3" and 6.5". 

We have thought long and hard about the way that the Orca Classics' sound ought to make someone feel.  But of course, people who do not prioritize "feelings," in the way they experience their music might dismiss this approach as hooey.  But most people immediately respond to the sound aesthetic of the Classics when they first hear them in person.  They are smooth and seductive.  Never a bad thing :)

The Orca Minis/Max are meant for a more performance oriented reproduction but still with the character of a single driver.  And still with the all wood, undamped, no BS cabinetry and so they still retain alot of our "classic" signature sound.  We sought out to innovate with the woodwork of the Mini's and Maxes.  And we did!

The only downside is that the powerhandling/efficiency of the Mini is more geared towards a minimum of 4 watts rather than the 2 watts needed for the Classics.  However, we have heard of people successfully hooking up their classics to 50 watts and more, and also their Minis down to 2 watts (or up to and beyond 50 as well).  Satisfaction from amplifying our speakers seems to come from an individual's taste and implimentation.  Just like everything else in the world.  So - no real surprise there.

The Paramount 300B's at 8 watts provide the right balance between dynamic playback and delicacy for me and my system.  I like to play the Mini's and Maxes pretty loud and for extended times, actually.  They do not fatigue the listener when pushed.

The Mini's are a physically smaller speaker than the Classics, but they behave like a larger speaker in practical utility. 

You can think of the powerhandling of our lineup like this:

AND THIS IS JUST A BASIC RULE OF THUMB:

Classics: Minimum ~2 watts
Mini's: Minimum ~4 watts
Mako's: Minimum ~8 watts
Thrashers: Minimum ~16 watts

So the Mini's/Maxes are actually the "mid sized speaker" in our lineup, in terms of behavior, though they are the physically smallest speaker we make. 

I hope that information helps!

-Clark
 
Thanks for elaborating on the differences.  It would be fun swapping some Orca Minis into my system to hear how they compare in 2-channel playback with my sources and amps.
 
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