Neophyte in need of DIY audio cable guidance

[Kitchener]

Hello everyone, I'm new around here.
Not good at introductions so I'll just get to it.

I've been eyeing the ever increasingly alluring Crack for a good while now and this christmas I finally succumbed and placed an order.
And since I'm already head first down the rabbit hole, I figured I might try making my own cables as well.

I'm already a little familiar with DIY electronics from designing and building my own keyboards (the clickety-clacking kind, not for music) and the Crack manual is very comprehensive, so I'm not worried about the Crack.
-getting the wooden base completed with a proper finish might be a challenge though.

The cables however are quite a lot more esoteric to me.
And I apologize in advance for the inevitable mix up in terminology; phono, rca, banana plugs, jacks ....GAH!

I'm planning two wires:

• 1x 1/8" jack to RCA cable
  
• 1x 1/4" jack to Sennheiser HD600/650/6XX headphones
  

I've been scouring the web for information but I must admit that what I've come up with is based purely on imitation without understanding (monkey see, monkey do) so be prepared for ill-informed questions.

Both cables will consist of four solid core 20GA wires, insulated (not teflon):
Two for signal, two for ground.
Both cables will be covered in simple techflex.

• Both cables start with one plug and end with two plugs, is there any advantage to first making a four-wire braid that splits into two two-cable braids or can I just have two braids all the way?

-two-cable braids are waaay easier than four-cable braids!
All parts have already been ordered.

The 1/8" jack cable will go from my source to my amp.

• Does braiding the signal and ground cables act as some sort of shielding?
• Should I cut the ground cable before they reach the RCA plugs?

-something about avoiding a "ground loop"?

The 1/4" jack will go from the amp to my incoming Sennheiser HD6XX headphones (Massdrop).

• The grounds should go all the way to the headphones here, right?

And finally, how about hot-gluing the insides of the plugs after soldering, yay or nay?
I saw one DIY-guide for Sennheiser headphone cables that recommended filling the plug cavities with hot-glue to finish them up.
Immediately this seems, to me, like a potentially good idea but I'm worried this could lead to audible interference.

I've included some sketches for the planned cables that I hope might illustrate what I've not been able to articulate.
Oh, and thanks for reading! 

 

[fullheadofnothing]

four solid core 20GA wires

This is not a good plan. Solid core is only to be used in places where it will not be subject to physical stress/bending (i.e. internal chassis wiring). Headphone wires/interconnects/speaker wire should be made with stranded wire.

• Braiding the wires can help reject noise, but it is not a shield. Braided copper or copper foil can be obtained if you find you need a proper shield.
• If you use a shield, you can choose to only attach it to ground at one end (which may or may not improve its noise rejection). If you are only using the two wires. You must connect the ground at both ends.
• I can't think of a single time I have glued a plug and not ended up regretting it later. YMMV. Its not about audibility of the glue, but solder joints can fail, or sometimes you want to re-purpose connectors.

All in all, I consider slapping some ends onto microphone cable the best way to construct interconnects. You can get shielded if you like, and virtrually every problem you have envisioned is avoided.

All keyboards are musical.
https://youtu.be/rRjHDPLib28

 

[Kitchener]

Headphone wires/interconnects/speaker wire should be made with stranded wire.

I  went through some deliberation regarding solid core vs. stranded.
And I agree with you, stranded is without a doubt more flexible.
But a few DIY guide I found used solid core (silver in most cases) and since my cables will sit relatively still in my office and solid core i easier to work with, I decided to go for solid core.

• Braiding the wires can help reject noise, but it is not a shield.

Thank you for clearing that up!

You must connect the ground at both ends.

Okay, will do.

I consider slapping some ends onto microphone cable the best way to construct interconnects.

Where were you four days ago when I ordered 40 meters of solid core hookup wire?
Can I use a shielded cable like the included image for the two cables I want to make?
Do I use the two wires inside for signal and the shielding for ground?
Or do I use two cables and use one wire inside each for ground?
-that will be one fat ass cable.

All keyboards are musical.

Tell that to my fiance!

 

[Paul Birkeland]

The 1/8" to RCA cable is a bit of a complicated one to tackle.  I would use 6 conductors and solder two each to the tip, ring, and shield of the 1/8" plug, then do a 6 wire litz braid for most of the length of the cable, split off 3 and 3, then do a standard braid to your RCA plugs.  Techflex and cable pants can help hide a mistake or two along the way.  As Josh mentioned, if you make this out of solid core wire, you're going to get to make it again later with stranded wire.

The headphone cable will really be dependent on your ability to solder to those pesky HD650 plugs.  I'd get a few extras to practice on.  I also wouldn't bother shielding that cable, as the signal levels present will be nice and high.

 

[Kitchener]

I would use 6 conductors and solder two each to the tip, ring, and shield of the 1/8" plug

So 6 separate wires? What thickness should I go for, 16GA?

if you make this out of solid core wire, you're going to get to make it again later with stranded wire.

Hah, it might be time I started listening to reason!
So, any recommendations with regards to the wire? Teflon insulation, gauge?

The headphone cable will really be dependent on your ability to solder

Well I’ve already learned a few valuable/expensive lessons about cold solder joints and melted components, so right now I’m optimistic and determined.
-probably soon to be replaced by shame and suicidal thoughts, but I’ll climb that mountain when I walk face first into it.

 

[ALL212]

If you need an assist on the HD6xx cables let me know.  I've built 1/6 dozen or more and the first couple got changed as I didn't like the way they came out.  Just did one and have parts for another on the way.  I've got my way of doing it - it works.  You can change it up any way you want.

 

[Paul Birkeland]

So 6 separate wires? What thickness should I go for, 16GA?

Yeah, while 2 wires would be enough to get the job done, you can't braid 2 wires, and if you twist them the cable may lay kinda funny when you're done.  16GA is more than adequate, I'd look for some 20AWG teflon jacketed stranded wire.  There's usually a lot of this available on eBay.

 

[Kitchener]

you can't braid 2 wires, and if you twist them the cable may lay kinda funny when you're done.

Thank you for pointing this out, Paul.
Pretty much every DIY interconnect/headphone cable guide I've seen split from a single four-wire braid to two two-wire twists, and I couldn't quite believe the two-wire twist would hold their shape very well.

I'm going to order some stranded wire as well, I'm not one to question the voice of experience (especially not from two profesional Bottleheads)

If you need an assist on the HD6xx cables let me know.

Thanks, Aaron, I'd love to hear how you make them!
I'm a sucker for DIY tips.
Send me an e-mail or post here, whatever suits you best.

 

[ALL212]

My secret recipe:

1) Stay away from techflex, it's noisy.  Been there, used it, removed it, was much happier.  When the cable with techflex moves against something the techflex transmits the sound into the headphones.  It's a hard surface...I really can't explain it better but the first cable I built came out beautiful with the techflex.  Very shortly after that I had a not so beautiful cable but I could move around without hearing the cable rub against my clothing.
2) Mogami W2534 microphone wire.  It's now very readily available and you can find it right around $1 per foot.  Check on Redco Audio.  Mogami wire comes with 2 twisted pairs and a fine copper wire shield.  The pairs only have two colors - white and blue - so you'll need a MM to sort them out in the final soldering.
3)  You've got two choices for the can end of the cable, Cardas and Furutech.  Both work well but the Furutech has a less chance of melting on you.  I've used both and prefer the Furutech but only because I find it easier to work with.  It does have more "parts" and you've got to be very careful not to lose pieces.  The Cardas is a bit harder to work with (IMO) and easier to melt but only 1 piece.  No matter which you chose you should either have a friend that trusts you with a soldering iron in close proximity or those "helping hands".
4)  Many choices on the 1/4 inch plug.  I've used Cardas, Furutech and ViaBlue.  I've not heard any difference and again I find the Furutech's a bit easier to work with. 
5)  Optional - cotton or silk sleeves.  I found these on a Chinese web site a long time ago and bought enough to last through quite a few builds.  If you use this I'd highly recommend having various sizes of heat shrink on hand.  These I use where the cable becomes the "Y" into the can ends.  I think it quiets the wire if it rubs against you but is certainly not required.  It can be a bit of a challenge to route the wire up these sleeves.
6)  Cable pants or an assortment of heatshrink sizes.  I'm using heatshrink now exclusively.

I think that should cover your parts.  Cable length?  I start mine at about 10' and have gone to 14'.  Don't go short on the "Y" - I think I'm at 12 to 14 inches now.

I've written this up over on another forum (no competition for Bottlehead that I know of). 

http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/146855/diy-sennheiser-hd650-cable-build


and commented recently on the thread for the HD6xxx's - I couldn't help myself at that price!
http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/177926/massdrop-edition-sennheiser-hd650s-drop-in-six-days-for-249-99/p3



Oh...and that forum - we've known each other for some time so you'll need to sort the BS from truth as you go.

 

[Kitchener]

2) Mogami W2534 microphone wire.

Oh...and that forum - we've known each other for some time so you'll need to sort the BS from truth as you go.

Okay, I'm intrigued by the use of microphone wires.
I read through your forum posts (yeah, you guys definitely seemed familar with one another ;D) and think I've got the general idea.


You solder some of the shielding with the ground wires on the jack end, is that right?
-I've made a sketch, does it look about right?

 

[ALL212]

Sketch looks correct.  I use a portion of the shield only because using all if it is a royal pain.  It requires more heat and if I remember correctly only the Cardas has room for all of it.

If you noticed some of the comments from the latest thread over on that forum - plan before soldering!  That includes size and position of heat shrink and getting the components threaded on the wire before you make the final soldering.  Oh...and over three beers is not recommended.  It appears that two drinks is max.

 

[Kitchener]

I can definitely get behind the two-drinks rule, it's comical how heavy handed my soldering becomes once the third beer pops open.
-and it's not the lead in the solder that's weighing me down, that's for sure.

Well, this is just grand, now I have three shipments incoming: solid core wire, stranded wire and microphone cable.
I guess I'll give friends and family audio interconnects for Christmas this year, I can't wait to see the looks of ecstasy on their faces...


EDIT:
It's just a matter of waiting for the parts now, I think I'll post the fruits of my labor and a short "wot I did" when they're done, in case it could be of help to other newbs.

 

[ALL212]

Head back to the 6xx thread and check out the latest build by one of the guys.  He used a really neat splitter and some "soft" techflex from 1/4 to the Y.

You need more parts... 

 

[Adrian]

I DIYed a cable for my HD600s and did a similar cable for my VISO HP50s.

Here's the link:  https://bottlehead.com/smf/index.php?topic=6657.msg66205#msg66205

 

[Kitchener]

I DIYed a cable for my HD600s and did a similar cable for my VISO HP50s.

Here's the link:  https://bottlehead.com/smf/index.php?topic=6657.msg66205#msg66205

I actually read that when I was researching DIY cables before I posted here.
-Your post made me discover cable “pants”!
Actually, I’m aiming to build cables pretty much exactly like yours, but I’ll try getting some cotton tubing on it as well; at least after the split I hope.

Head back to the 6xx thread and check out the latest build by one of the guys.  He used a really neat splitter and some "soft" techflex from 1/4 to the Y.

You need more parts... 

Neat!
I’m going to try to slip some cotton tubes on my cables and these weird Y-split cable pants I found on eBay.
More parts? More parts!?
Listen, I’m stretching my “this stuff? No, these are just cheap little things from China, babe” excuse to the limits as is!
And I still need some credibility when the Crack kit arrives, “this stuff? No, this is so cheap I even have to build it my self!” 

All in all, I consider slapping some ends onto microphone cable the best way to construct interconnects.

Yeah, I should just have listened to you to begin with.
I almost feel like I owe you a slight apology!