How important is the PC?

[denti alligator]

I anticipation of the BH DAC I have been thinking about my PC setup and how I'd like to improve it.

Right now I have an old (2006 or so) self-built HTPC with a Juli@ sound card running the newest version of J.River. My music is all on an external HD connected via USB.

Now if the USB cable that connects your PC to your DAC is really that important, then what about the PC itself? I could of course output with an optical cable from the Juli@, but it seems USB is the choice audiophiles make. Why?

Also, looking at the C.A.P.S. builds over at computer audiophile got me thinking. Those look like nice builds. Small, quiet, and supposedly performing at high levels. But then there's the choice of SOtM USB over regular. And the power options. And the fact that you can't just plug a HD with your music into the machine via USB.

Do all these things really matter when what we're talking about are 0s and 1s that will be converted by the external DAC? T what degree do they matter? If I continue to use my old HTPc and output the digital via SPDIF to the DAC, will it sound significantly worse than if I upgrade to a fanless mini PC with a SOtM USB and put the music all on a NAS?  That would cost quite a bit!

 

[earwaxxer]

Hey Sam - USB has really progressed in the past few years. Most definitely better sound than SPDIF out from the PC. What software you are running on the PC has more to do with the sound than the hardware IMHO. JRiver is one of the best for the PC. Mac's have theirs. Of course the fan noise could be an issue, in which case you need to upgrade the PC. Todays chips run MUCH cooler. The fan in my laptop almost never comes on. Its a second gen core2 with 6gb of ram. Already several years old. We are now in the 4th gen chips. If the PC is old, might be time to upgrade to a new laptop. ....They are good for other things as well! With JRiver set up the way I have it the songs play from RAM, with a 20 sec. buffer. Yes, of course, there is the cable. I wouldnt go crazy on that. I ordered a 15" AudioQuest Cinnamon for about $40 from The Cable Company. They were out, so they sent me a Carbon for the same price. I lucked out on that but I'm sure I would have been happy with the bargain basement Cinnamon. Amazing things you can do with a computer!

 

[RPMac]

If the BH-DAC is in charge of changing the rate, I don't need to see it...I just want to hear it.
BH-DAC for Christmas???

 

[madbrayniak]

I really dont know if that SoTM USB would yield you too much of a benefit, atleast not in regards to it's price.

I think the best thing you can do to get the best performance out of your PC is going to have one as silent as possible. Some seem to think that fans can even add to the sound because of the slight vibration on the electronics but I personally have not seen any evidence in that.

The biggest reason to use a USB for music playback is really because of Asynchronous operation where the PC becomes the slave to the DAC clock speed so you will get a better sound that way.

Personally, I think you will be fine with a simple PC going to the DAC. It doesnt have to be anything extravegant because the DAC is essentially the sound card for the PC anyways.

I am not an expert but I am going to be building a PC based on a mITX board and an i3 Haswell chip in a Streacom computer case and run the OS off of an SSD so that there are no moving parts in side so that it is dead silent in operation. I will be trying to set it up so that it runs on XBMC and have the music playback go out via USB to the DAC and then when I want to watch a movie from my home server I will try to have it automatically switch to the HDMI out to the AVR.

 

[mcandmar]

That SoTM board is interesting, but i'm skeptical.  If a DAC is asynchronous surly the fancy clock part is irreverent?  I can see a use for the external power supply as i built a linear supply for my ODAC which was normally powered by the USB bus which was a very noisy supply and would fluctuate in voltage if other USB devices were working, i.e. memory keys, external HDD's.  I actually build a fully blown USB Isolator but i've since learnt they are less than ideal from a jitter point of view.  John did hint in the DAC thread that he has implemented some form of filtering/isolation in the design so it remains to be seen if any of the above will be of any advantage.

He also pointed out the question of which is better between USB and Toslink/Coax was specific to the DAC as some work better with one than the other.  Certainly i have found that with cheaper DACs, the coax always outperforms the USB interface.  Sometimes its more than just noise measurements, some are limited to 96k via USB or TOSLink and can only go higher via coax.

 

[John Swenson]

I have done a lot of work to make the BH DAC as immune to outside influences as I can, but I have not had any time to actually test out how well it really is in that regard.

My guess is that it is not completely immune, that some things will make a difference, but not to nearly the amount as other DACs.

So I wouldn't go about spending time and effort to fix computer "issues" that may not have much affect with this DAC. If you are satisfied with other aspects of the system, I would leave it alone and see what it sounds like first. Once it "hits the streets" I am sure there will be plenty of people doing all kinds of tests with different configurations and figure out just works best and how much of difference different things make to this DAC.

Normally I would say that a good asynchronous USB implementation will beat a good S/PDIF implementation, BUT in this case I have spent a huge amount of effort ( and I really do mean huge) making an exceptional S/PDIF input. The result is that the SQ from all the inputs should be very similar. The upshot is that if you already have an S/PDIF output from whatever, you can keep on using it with the BH DAC and know that you are not loosing anything compared to one of the other inputs.

Currently I have my prototype hooked up USB to a Squeezebox Touch, and an old DVD player over optical S/PDIF, they both sound identical. I can play a CD in the player and I don't hear any difference compared to the USB connection from the Touch playing the ripped tracks. So I think I have pretty much succeeded with this goal.

BTW they both sound amazing.

John S.

 

[denti alligator]

So will thing outperform my Denon cd/SACD player? Obviously it can't handle DSD (and my player can't output that, anyway), but for red book? Should I then output from that player as well as from the PC to the DAC? Will there be two inputs?

 

[Paul Birkeland]

DSD is a potential future upgrade.
There are 3 inputs (USB, Toslink, S/PDIF).

 

[RPMac]

John, I'm using a Squeezebox Classic...do I need to up grade to the Touch?

 

[BNAL]

John, I'm using a Squeezebox Classic...do I need to up grade to the Touch?

The Squeezebox classic is limited to 24/48 so if the music you have is limited to the resolution you will not have a problem. Otherwise you will need a device that supports higher resolution files.

 

[RPMac]

I don't understand all that I probably need to know about digital, especially considering that all my music is on a hard drive and accessed through iTunes to the Squeezebox. Everything seems to be 16 bit/ 44.1 kHz. Is this what I'm looking for?

Other than getting the BH-DAC, is there anything else I should do?

 

[John Swenson]

If your SB classic is doing what you want, then just connect either of the digital outs (coax or TOSLINK) to the DAC, enjoy!

John S.

 

[madbrayniak]

I'm curious,

Can you set up a PC to output music from say, JRiver via USB/Toslink and then when you want to watch a movie it will automatically change to HDMI?

A small HTPC would be something really nice to have in this kind of situation where you can have a high quality DAC going to some tube gear but stilll allow surround sound for when watching movies....

 

[RPMac]

If your SB classic is doing what you want, then just connect either of the digital outs (coax or TOSLINK) to the DAC, enjoy!

John S.

Waiting on you! ;D