Fostex FE126 EN, in Madisound BK-12M kit
- Thread starter Noskipallwd
- Start date
Shawn,
Any more updates? Having been through three iterations of another very similar design I can confidently state that these need a good 400 hours to break-in, but continue to improve slightly for probably double that length of time.
I don't know the design, but if there is an empty sealed chamber near the bottom, you can fill it with BBs and sand, or just a lot of BBs and that tends to make things even smoother and the bass still better.
You could also bolt them to a heavy maple block -- the michigan maple 12" x 18" x 4" ones work really wel and aren't terribly expensive -- they are just maple cutting boards.
These look really interesting, and an awful lot of speaker for the price. I may just have to build a set to see how well they do with the s.e.x. and stereomour as I'm always looking for reasonable, high-value, decent sounding speakers for friends on a tight budget.
-- Jim
Any more updates? Having been through three iterations of another very similar design I can confidently state that these need a good 400 hours to break-in, but continue to improve slightly for probably double that length of time.
I don't know the design, but if there is an empty sealed chamber near the bottom, you can fill it with BBs and sand, or just a lot of BBs and that tends to make things even smoother and the bass still better.
You could also bolt them to a heavy maple block -- the michigan maple 12" x 18" x 4" ones work really wel and aren't terribly expensive -- they are just maple cutting boards.
These look really interesting, and an awful lot of speaker for the price. I may just have to build a set to see how well they do with the s.e.x. and stereomour as I'm always looking for reasonable, high-value, decent sounding speakers for friends on a tight budget.
-- Jim
Noskipallwd
New member
Hey Jim,
I have put alot of hours on the Fostex drivers lately, I recently aquired a Jolida tube phonostage and have enjoyed running my LP12 and Concept through it.
Yes, the SQ is continually improving, and I have finally settled on the best placement for them. The soundstage is already excellent, now I understand the single driver thing. Well recorded symphonic vinyl sounds fantastic through these.
There is a small triangular space there, I'll have tap into it and give this a try.
They say great minds think alike! HeHe, actually I built stands for them using 1" square steel tube stock for frames with spiked feet in the corners. I bolted 2" thick maple cutting boards on top of the frames and the speaker cabs to those. They lifted the drivers to a better listening height, but the SQ change has been fairly minimal so far.
I would recommend these to anyone with a small listening area interested in great single driver full-range speakers that won't break the bank. They are a good bang for buck deal. I haven't been able to decide on how to finish them though, any recommendations?
Cheers,
Shawn
I have put alot of hours on the Fostex drivers lately, I recently aquired a Jolida tube phonostage and have enjoyed running my LP12 and Concept through it.
jrebman said:
Yes, the SQ is continually improving, and I have finally settled on the best placement for them. The soundstage is already excellent, now I understand the single driver thing. Well recorded symphonic vinyl sounds fantastic through these.
jrebman said:
There is a small triangular space there, I'll have tap into it and give this a try.
jrebman said:
They say great minds think alike! HeHe, actually I built stands for them using 1" square steel tube stock for frames with spiked feet in the corners. I bolted 2" thick maple cutting boards on top of the frames and the speaker cabs to those. They lifted the drivers to a better listening height, but the SQ change has been fairly minimal so far.
jrebman said:
I would recommend these to anyone with a small listening area interested in great single driver full-range speakers that won't break the bank. They are a good bang for buck deal. I haven't been able to decide on how to finish them though, any recommendations?
Cheers,
Shawn
Shawn,
Finishing is always a matter of personal taste, but all kinds of possibilities are open with these because of the BB ply (which I think looks fine finished natrural, but can also be a lot of work, especially if using an oil finish on the end grain sections. Wipe-on poly also works well, as does veneering -- I veneered my last pair of Horn Shoppe horns with australian lacewood and they came out beautifully and now live with a neighbor who loves them. because the construction is not done with bevel joints and the eend grain is exposed, a good bit of sanding prep will be needed, and you should stick with paperback veneer and contact cement or a vacuum press and cold press glue -- raw veneer and heatlok glues will probably not hold up as well.
If painting, try to use one of the textured paints -- also because of the exposed end grain -- as the wood shrinks and swells, the textured paints will telegraph the seams much less than a glossy or even semi gloss paint.
All up to you, of course. but I think the textured paint can look really good on these and I'd probably do my pair in red instead of black, and Debk would probably do hers in purple
. For me, a stain annd wipe-on poly would probably be the next choice -- all depending on the room it is likely to be used in.
My eldest neice will be 11 in January, which means the following year she will get her first stereo from uncle Jim, and these are looking like a very likely pair of speakers for her -- now I just have to find out what her favorite color is.
Thanks for the update and glad to hear they're doing so well.
-- Jim
Finishing is always a matter of personal taste, but all kinds of possibilities are open with these because of the BB ply (which I think looks fine finished natrural, but can also be a lot of work, especially if using an oil finish on the end grain sections. Wipe-on poly also works well, as does veneering -- I veneered my last pair of Horn Shoppe horns with australian lacewood and they came out beautifully and now live with a neighbor who loves them. because the construction is not done with bevel joints and the eend grain is exposed, a good bit of sanding prep will be needed, and you should stick with paperback veneer and contact cement or a vacuum press and cold press glue -- raw veneer and heatlok glues will probably not hold up as well.
If painting, try to use one of the textured paints -- also because of the exposed end grain -- as the wood shrinks and swells, the textured paints will telegraph the seams much less than a glossy or even semi gloss paint.
All up to you, of course. but I think the textured paint can look really good on these and I'd probably do my pair in red instead of black, and Debk would probably do hers in purple
. For me, a stain annd wipe-on poly would probably be the next choice -- all depending on the room it is likely to be used in.My eldest neice will be 11 in January, which means the following year she will get her first stereo from uncle Jim, and these are looking like a very likely pair of speakers for her -- now I just have to find out what her favorite color is
.Thanks for the update and glad to hear they're doing so well.
-- Jim
Just discovered you post. I have Hornshoppe Horns, which use the Fostex FE126EN driver.
They play extremely clean. A couple of tube watts can play them above 110 db without distorting. Though I don't play them that loud, I have tried it, just for the fun of it. I also added a Fostex T90 Super Tweeter which even enhances the sound of the Horns. Secret is to cross them over rather high, like at 35 khz, using a 0.33uf cap. This way the Supertweeter does not add anything in the frequency the FE126 plays, but it 'continues' the upper Frequency response, which lets you see much deeper into the acoustical scene. Having the Supertweeter, I no longer would want to live without it.
They play extremely clean. A couple of tube watts can play them above 110 db without distorting. Though I don't play them that loud, I have tried it, just for the fun of it. I also added a Fostex T90 Super Tweeter which even enhances the sound of the Horns. Secret is to cross them over rather high, like at 35 khz, using a 0.33uf cap. This way the Supertweeter does not add anything in the frequency the FE126 plays, but it 'continues' the upper Frequency response, which lets you see much deeper into the acoustical scene. Having the Supertweeter, I no longer would want to live without it.
Regarding JimR's post on veneering raw BB plywood (such as the Madisound BK12 kit) - I've built more than a few dozen pairs over the years using the iron-on wood glue technique with quite satisfactory results (including the Macassar Ebony enclosures for Jim's Fostex F120As a couple of years back)
Aside from the most obvious issue with contact cement - no room for adjustment, there's also the potential for solvent based stains/finishes to penetrate paper backed or pure veneers and delaminate solvent based contact cement.
Yes, the butt joints and exposed edge grain will need good sanding and a glue-size pre-coat to eliminate telegraphing through the veneer, but at the end of the day, it's no more work than proper prep for a paint job, even when applying textured products.
The BK12 has two small triangular cavities at the top of the fold and a slightly larger one at the bottom - filling those with BBs, crushed glass blasting media, sand etc certainly can't hurt.
As the mouth on this design is forward facing, it won't benefit from boundary reinforcement as do the Hornshoppe, FH3, or any rear mouth BLH.
Aside from the most obvious issue with contact cement - no room for adjustment, there's also the potential for solvent based stains/finishes to penetrate paper backed or pure veneers and delaminate solvent based contact cement.
Yes, the butt joints and exposed edge grain will need good sanding and a glue-size pre-coat to eliminate telegraphing through the veneer, but at the end of the day, it's no more work than proper prep for a paint job, even when applying textured products.
The BK12 has two small triangular cavities at the top of the fold and a slightly larger one at the bottom - filling those with BBs, crushed glass blasting media, sand etc certainly can't hurt.
As the mouth on this design is forward facing, it won't benefit from boundary reinforcement as do the Hornshoppe, FH3, or any rear mouth BLH.
Chris,
So is the BK-12 the same basic configuration as the bk-16? Sounds like it, in which case my recommendation for filling with BBs probably won't do all that much as compared to the sizeable void aat the bottom of the Horn Shoppe horns.
From what many bk-16 builders said, an extra layer of 1/2" or 3/4" ply on the sides was a pretty useful addition, which probably means a 3/8" extra layer on the sides of the bk-12 might be a good thing.
As for the veneer, I suppose whatever each person is comfortable with is fine but I'm mostly trying to stay away from veneer and paint these days myself.
I would still however, stuff the triangular voids with something -- felt, or whatever, just to cut down on resonance, but not having heard this speaker, I don't even know if that is an issue.
I will really just have to get a pair of these -- they really look like they have a lot of potential, especially for te price -- less than $400 total for a sweet liittle floor standing speaker is somethig that has a lot of appeal.
-- Jim
So is the BK-12 the same basic configuration as the bk-16? Sounds like it, in which case my recommendation for filling with BBs probably won't do all that much as compared to the sizeable void aat the bottom of the Horn Shoppe horns.
From what many bk-16 builders said, an extra layer of 1/2" or 3/4" ply on the sides was a pretty useful addition, which probably means a 3/8" extra layer on the sides of the bk-12 might be a good thing.
As for the veneer, I suppose whatever each person is comfortable with is fine but I'm mostly trying to stay away from veneer and paint these days myself.
I would still however, stuff the triangular voids with something -- felt, or whatever, just to cut down on resonance, but not having heard this speaker, I don't even know if that is an issue.
I will really just have to get a pair of these -- they really look like they have a lot of potential, especially for te price -- less than $400 total for a sweet liittle floor standing speaker is somethig that has a lot of appeal.
-- Jim
I've been looking into the FE126EN too lately. I want to sell off my Axiom M60Ti to build a set of Saburo horns.
I don't know if it's the right step over what I currently own, but I love the way they look and I like the idea of building it with my own two hands.
I keep imagining what the Saburo would sound like with tubes :0)
I don't know if it's the right step over what I currently own, but I love the way they look and I like the idea of building it with my own two hands.
I keep imagining what the Saburo would sound like with tubes :0)
Hi to all on the forum. This is my first post here. Three days ago, I completed my first speaker build, a pair of the BK-12s. I am very pleased with the sound so far. They just sound great, and the bass is amazing for a 4.5" driver. I am driving them with a home built Zen4 from the PassDIY site - I love the amp, have had it for about 5 years now. I have a foreplay3 on order to go with the system, no decent preamp now, and the Zen really needs one. The placement and orientation of the speakers in the room is seems critical...but the room is very odd shaped.
Noskipallwd
New member
Have not checked in on this thread in a while. Ralph, I like the way you finished those, mine are still naked. Yes, these speakers require alot of attention to placement, and are best suited to a small listening space. They do take a long time to settle in. Chris, and Jim, I put some steel sandblast media in the bottom space of the cabinet. Although very subtle it seemed to improve the clarity of the bass and mids. All an all they are great little speakers, I'm driving them with the first amp I ever built, a S5 electronics K16l push pull integrated. Considering they sound good driven by this amp, I can't wait to see how they perform driven by a Stereomour or some Paramounts!
Cheers,
Shawn P.
Cheers,
Shawn P.
Thanks for the compliment on the finish. I got a little bit of glue on the "end grain" of the plywood that is visible from the front - will tape off some areas on my next build. After almost 2 weeks with the BK 12s I really love them for most of my music. They excel at jazz, folk and acoustic blues. Not as good with the "old" rock I listen to on occasion. Very curious to see what difference adding the Foreplay III to the system makes.
Then maybe another system for the times I feel like rocking out. Hmmmmm.... NP's BA3, or a PP tube amp
The possibilities are endless...
Ralph
Then maybe another system for the times I feel like rocking out. Hmmmmm.... NP's BA3, or a PP tube amp
The possibilities are endless...
Ralph
randy@matrixq.com
New member
I would agree with Catp.Z, the Fostex drivers seem to need a lot of break-in. I'm using the FE-166's in the BK-16 cabinets. Basically, the same thing just a scoonch larger all around. I have a pretty small listening room, as well.
I built mine two years ago and broke them in for 50 hours thinking that would do it. They sounded pretty good after 50 but just kept getting better. Every now and then, I'd play an album that I hadn't played and I was taken aback by some detail I hadn't noticed the time before. I'm currently driving them with a Foreplay III (stock) and a highly modded SEX amp.
They are part of my Heaven.
Someday, I may just have to build some horns for the 8" 206e's.
Looks like you did a great job on your build. You will get a lot of positive comments on those. Mine certainly start a lot of conversations.
I built mine two years ago and broke them in for 50 hours thinking that would do it. They sounded pretty good after 50 but just kept getting better. Every now and then, I'd play an album that I hadn't played and I was taken aback by some detail I hadn't noticed the time before. I'm currently driving them with a Foreplay III (stock) and a highly modded SEX amp.
They are part of my Heaven.
Someday, I may just have to build some horns for the 8" 206e's.
Looks like you did a great job on your build. You will get a lot of positive comments on those. Mine certainly start a lot of conversations.
I've been seeking out an easy first speaker build project and the BK-12M looks like a nice starting point. I currently use Blumenstein Orca's so I'm familiar with the fostex fullrange drivers and how lovely they can sound. My other thought is jumping up to the BK-16 if there is a significant benefit in frequency response.
I would assume the bass on these are good enough for acoustic genres of music like folk, jazz and classical but would benefit from an active sub? I like the idea of having separate speaker systems which focus on specific genres of music. Something I learned during my years of buying and trying headphones is there is no one can that can do it all perfectly.
I plan to drive them with either my Bottlehead SEX 2.1 or Stereomour feed by my Hagerman Bugle2 phono and Rega RP1.
Thanks!
I would assume the bass on these are good enough for acoustic genres of music like folk, jazz and classical but would benefit from an active sub? I like the idea of having separate speaker systems which focus on specific genres of music. Something I learned during my years of buying and trying headphones is there is no one can that can do it all perfectly.
I plan to drive them with either my Bottlehead SEX 2.1 or Stereomour feed by my Hagerman Bugle2 phono and Rega RP1.
Thanks!
