Eros Output Caps

[johnsonad]

I move the V Cap Teflon's from my Eros tape to the Tube Phono replacing a pair of Auricaps. The difference was immediate and I'm kicking myself for not doing it earlier. The Auricaps are great but I'm a detail guy and the Teflon's seem to get  a little more out of what's already there.

 

[Dnorris]

I'm starting a new Eros build (stock first, of course), but have a pair of .47uf audio grade film capacitors that I want to try as well. To clarify, it looks like the design value for the output stage caps is .47uf as per Grainger's post, the parts checklist & schematic show 1.0uf and the included kit caps are 1.5uf. Am I correct in assuming the .47uf would work fine, just changing the bass rolloff point somewhat? Thanks in advance.

 

[Dnorris]

Oops, Sorry, forgot to add my name to my initial post.
Dale Norris, located in the Kansas City area. Built a Crack + Speedball with some tube rolling last year. Very happy with that indeed, spectacular sound with HD650.

 

[Paul Birkeland]

Yes, your statement about the low frequency performance is correct.

At the time that we put out the Eros, we had the 1.0uF Solen capacitor in our inventory for the SEX amp of that era.  When selecting the coupling cap for the Eros, we simply used the 1.0uF Solen because it was already in the inventory and it is a nice sounding cap.

Currently, the SEX parafeed cap is 1.5uF, so that ships with the Eros as well.

 

[Paul Joppa]

To add a bit here - the output stage of Eros is the same as Seduction (now Reduction). The original Seduction had a 0.47uF cap, which could work with load as low as 15Kohms, but with a trace of deep bass loss, -3dB at 22.5Hz. With Eros, we wanted an upgrade in performance and parts, and the 1.0uF Solen seemed appropriate.

 

[Natural Sound]

To add a bit here - the output stage of Eros is the same as Seduction (now Reduction). The original Seduction had a 0.47uF cap, which could work with load as low as 15Kohms, but with a trace of deep bass loss, -3dB at 22.5Hz. With Eros, we wanted an upgrade in performance and parts, and the 1.0uF Solen seemed appropriate.

Hmmm... Good to know. I have a .47uF in my Seduction and it sounds real nice. Especially with my new Ortofon Blue cart. But I do have a pair of 1.0uF Solen capacitors that were removed from my S.E.X. 2.0 when I installed the MQ iron upgrade. I might just swap those into my Seduction for experimentation purposes. 

 

[Hank Murrow]

The BH Customs "Eros" that PB built for me has 1uf TFTF V-caps at the output and the bass has plenty of extension and timbre. The bass drum whacks on the Holst Wind Band Suites with Frederick Fennel sound plenty deep and tactile, rattling a couple of hanging prints when listening quite loud. I have never tried swapping caps though, so cannot give a comparison____ it just sounds great!

Hank in Eugene

 

[JamieMcC]

Hank that is super the two Paul's really look to have cooked you up a beauty and something that must give a high level of pride in ownership as well as beautiful sounding music.

Jamie

 

[Hank Murrow]

I was very lucky that Dan introduced me to Paul Birkeland at the Vancouver VSAC. He also built my Soul Sister/Kugelis linestage, a fine stereo 2A3 amp, and a Custom Crack with many trick features including Submissive volume controls and a special PS. It sounds quite wonderful with my Cardas-cabled Senn 600's, reaching deeper into the low bass than my speaker system. I sometimes listen to my headphones while using my MacBook Pro and it is delightful to work this way. The other pieces also use V-Caps in all signal circuits.
Cheers, Hank

 

[JamieMcC]

Hi Hank, the Teflon capacitors are rather addictive aren't they. I was really surprised recently after taking some out of my Cracks circuit at just how plasticky and course my film caps sounded without them on  bypass duty. Prior to their fitting I was over the moon with the improvement the films gave over the stock electrolytes as well. The new ones are still in the burn in phase but already are sounding very delicious.

Cheers, Jamie

 

[ZenAudio]

To add a bit here - the output stage of Eros is the same as Seduction (now Reduction). The original Seduction had a 0.47uF cap, which could work with load as low as 15Kohms, but with a trace of deep bass loss, -3dB at 22.5Hz. With Eros, we wanted an upgrade in performance and parts, and the 1.0uF Solen seemed appropriate.

Is there a consensus on what the ideal cap size would be for the Eros? My stock Solen's are 1.5uF and the bass is great.  One can obviously save money on 0.47uF boutique capacitors, but I don't want to weaken the bottom end.  Mundorf has a 0.47uF, 0.68uF, 1uF and 1.5uF.  From browsing earlier comments here, I saw that Grainger and DebK were even using 0.22uF and seemed happy.  Input appreciated before I run amok at the capacitor candy store.

 

[Paul Joppa]

There are two criteria that I use. First, the cap must be large enough to pass bass into the power amp's input impedance. Second, it must be large enough that its impedance is lower than the output impedance of the preamp at 120Hz - the power supply hum frequency. The second reduces the chance of hum pickup from electric fields. The 0.47uF meets the second criterion, and also meets the first if the power amp input impedance is above 15K - though the amp is specified to drive 50K or more.

 

[ZenAudio]

Thanks PJ.  So, since my Stereomour II has a 50K input impedance, is it safe to say the 0.47uF's will git 'er done on both criteria and save me a little coin?  ;D

 

[Paul Joppa]

Absolutely!

 

[ZenAudio]

Awesome!  Since I also own a Seduction as well, I think I may start with a couple pairs of "relatively affordable" 0.47uF Mundorf MCap Supremes and Jupiter HT Beeswax for a shoot-out.  Then I might upgrade to the "relatively less affordable" Mundorf Silver Oils and/or Jupiter Copper Foils, and move the shoot-out winner over to the Seduction. 

I recently had Warren Jarrett (Audio Note dealer here in SoCal) over for a listening session to audition a "gently used" Audio Note IQ3 MM cartridge.  He also brought along a fairly pricey Music First 632 phono preamp (solid state and it uses the Mundorf MCap Supremes) and it sounded really, really good in my system. I'm betting it's those boutique caps that were bringing the magic...

 

[rockpassion]

Mike,

I used  a pair of .22uf 600v Russian FT-3 Teflon capacitors.  I found the differences were mainly in the soundstage which became much more precise.  Also, the mids and highs are just outstanding and extremely musical.  I cannot tell a difference in bass response, the bass is very tight and deep enough for me. 

I did not compare these caps to any other caps other than the ones that came with the kit.  But I will say the difference is very noticeable and I am extremely happy with the results. 

Good luck.

Richard