Cartridge for Seduction, SEX, and VPI Scoutmaster w/ JMW9

[pevelg]

I just received my used VPI Scoutmaster with JMW 9 arm.  This table replaced my old Rega Planar 3 with RB300.  I am needing a cartridge that will mate well with my current system which includes a Seduction preamp with C4s update, a yet to be built SEX amp (currently using a SS receiver), and Soliloquy 5.0 or Paradigm Studio 60v2 speakers.  So far I have been recommended the following cartridges:

1. Shure V15MR
2. Ortofon Black
3. Sumiko Blackbird
4. Dynavector 20
5. Grado Sonata?

I hear great things about the Shure and am leaning that way.  However, based on reviews, the sound that is described from the Sonata seems to go along more to my preferences.  However, I do not know if it would be a good match for the Seduction and Sex amp, while I heard the Shure is a great match.  Anyways, what advice can you offer me here?  This is my last "TEST" purchase in the analog world.  If I can't get the sound I want, I might leave vinyl all together.  The scout master currently has an EXTREMELY cheap audio technica cartridge that was used only to make sure everything worked.  This cart sounds quite horrid.  Anybody use the carts I mentioned?  I'd like to limit my budget to around $500, willing to buy used.  Any advice would be welcome, thanks.

 

[pevelg]

I am being offered a Grado Reference cart at a good price that was designed for VPI tables and has a 1.5mv rating.  I know that the Seduction is designed for 5mv and can do well down to 2.5mv.  Has anyone used a 1.5mv cart or this specific cart with a Seduction?  I read on here that one individual used a 1.6mv cart successfully on their Seduction.  My current speakers are also low sensitivity, so I don't expect to hear a hum.  I might decided to upgrade to the Eros unit, which should be able to work well with this cart, right?

 

[Paul Birkeland]

I think there is a question that must be asked before strong recommendations can be made: do you plan to upgrade to an Eros in the future?

The extra gain of the Eros will help a lot if you plan to go with a high output MC cartridge.  There are some pretty nice ones in your price range that may be a little light on output voltage for use with the Seduction.  


Seeing your reply, 1.5mv is way, way on the low side.  You could get a 1:5 step up transformer for use with the 1.5mv cartridge and the Seduction.

On the other hand, when you add up the cost of the Seduction, the additional costs of the step up transformers (figure 100-250), and you add in the C4S upgrade (which you would have to have to squeeze every last bit of gain out of it), you will end up at a price point that is not so far from the Eros.  If you are really getting a good price on the 1.5mv Grado cart, then the excess budget you have will be well spent using the Eros instead.  It will quite happily work with a 1.5mv cartridge without the fuss and setup associated with the stepups/Seduction. 

 

[Grainger49]

I had a Sure V15MR and gave it to my brother.  It really didn't suit me.  I replaced it with a nice Grado 4.5mV cartridge, that one was replaced with a Grado Sonata-1 4.5mV output.  Both Grados have the right output for my Seduction.

The Blackbird is still too low an output for a Seduction as is the Dynavector 20X.  Sadly, your list has only 3 that have a high enough output to keep the signal out of the noise floor on a Seduction.

 

[pevelg]

Vinyl is just one of those things that I am not yet entirely sold on.  I've decided that I will go all out, scoutmaster, grado reference, and I guess the Eros now.  If this combo doesn't cut it for me, I'll just resell everything.  My Rega and Seduction was my first real taste of vinyl and I really enjoyed it.  I really enjoy cleaning the records, putting it on the table, putting on the clamp, starting the motor, watching platter spin, lowering the tonearm, and hearing the magic.  So much more pleasurable operating compared to cd's.  And the sound is so wonderful.  With my Rega, vocals were far superior to that of the same albums in cd format.  Yesterday I figured out why the Audio Technica sounded so horrible, had something to do with a setting on my roommates SS amp.  The scoutmaster is a great table and I love the engineering.

Does Bottlehead have an exchange program where a built seduction can be returned to cover part of a new purchase like the Eros?

 

[Paul Birkeland]

If you are trading up to an Eros, I would bet that Doc will let you sell the Seduction on the forum.  Generally speaking, a well built Seduction will fetch about the asking price for the kit. 

 

[Doc B]

Yes, PB is right. We don't take trade-ins on kits, but a kit being sold to finance the purchase of a new kit is the one exception I make to my "no for sale posts on the forum" rule. If anyone is wanting to do this, just check with me first and I'll give you the go ahead to post your item.

 

[Grainger49]

Is there a dedicated trading post here on the new site?

 

[pevelg]

Before I post this to sell somewhere, I wanted to make sure my ohms and voltages where ok.  Here are my results:

OHMS:
---------------------------
Input A: 47.1K  B:47.1K
7: 0.4
10: 0.4
14: 0.4
16: 0.4
17: 156.3
19: 166.2
22: 164.8
24: 174.8
26: .991Meg
28: 0.4
31: 0.4
35: 0.4
36: .990Meg
38: 0.4
41: 0.4
45: 0.4
a2: .991Meg
b2: .990Meg
a3: 1Meg
b3: 1Meg
a7: 47.3K
b7: 47.4K
a8: 1Meg
b8: 1 Meg
output a:471K  b:471K

Volts:
------------------
6:6.5
7:0
9:5.9
10:0
11:0
12:129.3<------slightly off
14:0
15:147.2
16:0
20:0
25:165.6<------slightly off
26:0
36:0
27:72.9
37:72.8
28:0
38:0
29:72.3
39:72.2
30:72.2
40:72.1
34:129.1
44:129.1
35:0
45:0
a1:54.5<-------------------Way off
b1:70.3
a2:0
b2:0
a3:1.6
b3:1.6
a4:0
b4:0
a5:5.9
b5:5.9
a6:71.7
b6:71.6
a7:0
b7:0
a8:1.6
b8:1.6
a9:0
b9:0

Most look pretty good I think, other than the voltage on A1.  How do I fix this?  Is it the tube?  Is this unit good enough to sell or do I need to tweak something to make ohms/voltages more accurate?  Thanks.

 

[pevelg]

I just switched the tubes and now b1 is showing around 56 and a1 around 72.  Does this mean I need a new tube/s?  Do I order from here or elsewhere?

EDIT:  BTW, my Seduction has the c4s upgrade.

EDITx2:  Also, the Eros should do fine with a 1.5mv output cart?

 

[Paul Birkeland]

It looks like you have a tube with a slightly weak half.  If you have EH 6922's in there, just purchase an additional single and include the trio in the sale.

 

[booangler]

What are you going to be asking for the seduction?

Alan

The joy of music should never be interrupted by a commercial. - Leonard Bernstein